Kori Stephens on Radical Alignment
Season 2, Episode 14
Summary:
“There's a really big disconnect between some of the systems we put in place, and what our community really needs. And that was the struggle for me was trying to figure out how do we bridge this gap? And really show up?” – Kori Stephens
What if our words, actions, systems, and culture were all aligned? What could that do for communities, businesses, and the alteration of leadership? This is a deep conversation that covers a lot of territory with Kori Stephens (she/her), a culture curator, leadership coach, organizational consultant and wholeness revolutionary. Yes, a wholeness revolutionary and you’re going to want to listen to discover how much we need this movement. Kori is the Founder of Resonance Rising which supports her mission through consulting, coaching and the development of the Resonant Leader Lab. Hear how radical alignment is both possible and necessary on this episode of Champions of RISK.
Links:
Transcript:
Michael Kithcart:
Hello, I'm Michael Kithcart. I'm a high performance business coach and entrepreneur who helps worn out super achievers move from step to unstoppable. Welcome to the Champions of RISK podcast, where we examine the many aspects of risks so we can all face uncertainty with more strength, courage, and together. Kori Stephens is a culture curator, a leadership coach, organizational consultant, and wholeness revolutionary, I love this description, can't wait to dig into it. Her mission is to amplify the resilience of communities by empowering radically aligned leaders. She believes that leading people is both a responsibility and a gift that requires a deep commitment to personal growth and evolution. In 2020, Kori launched Resonance Rising to support her mission through consulting coaching and the development of the resonant leader lab. Kori, welcome to the Champions of RISK podcast.
Kori Stephens:
Thank you so much for having me.
Michael Kithcart:
This is just gonna be juicy. There's lots of directions we're gonna go today. So let's just start with you sharing your professional journey with us leading up to Resonance Rising because it feels like your past experience influenced so much what of what you're doing now?
Kori Stephens:
Yeah, absolutely. Wow. So I've been reflecting on this a lot, especially as I made this leap. So when I first got out of undergrad, I had a, I had majored in Global Studies and French, two degrees that I was like, What do I do with this, I ended up working for an international development organization that did economic and infrastructural development in the Middle East and West Africa, and was really kind of a jack of all trades at this very, very small nonprofit, which is where I learned so many things. And I realized in that moment that I was not as connected to the people we were serving that I wanted to be, I kind of had this theory of what international development was. And it was finding in that moment that it just really wasn't resonant with what I wanted to be bringing to the world. So I started looking for positions, and I came across one at Children's in Minnesota. And after an interview, I ended up working there for 11 years. And it was within a program called the Midwest Regional Children's Advocacy Center. That is a federally funded program that serves child abuse professionals across the country. So my time there was really spent in providing education and training and workshops, teaching development and team development for these child serving agencies started, you know, as an outreach coordinator, there then moved into a leadership position for the last six years of my time there. And many iterations kind of within there of what I thought I wanted to be doing and how I wanted to be contributing and feel they've all kind of come to a culmination and what I'm creating and Resonance Rising, and just recently stepped out of that full time job into being an entrepreneur in January of this year.
Michael Kithcart:
Yeah, that's, well, that is a big leap. I want to I'm curious to know, because I've done some work in international development, too, and have worked with women's empowerment groups in developing countries, and I agree with you on a day to day basis, if you don't have that connection. And so I'm curious, you then go into a field that is supporting professionals around child abuse, which is a really, you know, like, that's a weighty topic and important work. And I'm just curious, like, what you feel like, some of the key lessons are that you took away being working in the child abuse field that maybe impacted your perspective as a mother, as a sister, and as a community partner and leader.
Kori Stephens:
Yeah, you know, when I stepped into that job, I had no idea what I was stepping into, it wasn't like, I grew up thinking that I would work in the Children's Advocacy Center movements. And, you know, as I was studying Global Studies, I had mainly looked worked in human rights and child rights work. And so that's what initially attracted me to the work. And I think what I quickly learned, right, and I think many of us experienced this is what I learned academically, was not what I was experiencing in the real world. Although it helped me with our surprise, right. And so I think, you know, the biggest things that I started to see and be able to observe was just the many layers of systems that ultimately impact how we care for people in our communities, all the way from, you know, federal legislation, federal government to state contracts and mandates and laws to just like the culture within teams, and how that made a big difference for how we even keep kids and families at the center of our decision making. And so, you know, those are my biggest takeaways, as I started working through that is like, wow, this is complex. And there's so much opportunity to kind of realign or get clarity around what's really important and like listening to what the kids and families in our communities actually need. But there's like a really big disconnect between some of the systems we put in place, and what our community really needs. And that was the struggle for me is trying to figure out how do we bridge this gap and really show up?
Michael Kithcart:
Yes, and I hope that your business is going to start answering those questions. That's what you're going to tell me right?
Kori Stephens:
Actually, yes.
Michael Kithcart:
Because what you're saying feels very similar to education to then and really like, how are we helping kids learn, which is, you know, could be a whole other subject line. So let's stay on task here. I am curious, though, like did your work in in the child abuse field and really like seeing the the systemic issues that it's complex- Does that influence your decision to also be a birth and postpartum doula? Or were you already that before you stepped into the work?
Kori Stephens:
Yeah, so interesting. So no, I wasn't a doula. When I stepped into the work. I had gone back for a Master's in Public Health, about two to three years after I started working in the child abuse field, which was a debate because I had always thought maybe I want to do direct service. But my current position, I was doing more systems macro level work. And I decided, you know, that's probably the space for me, I think I would carry the stories of those I was serving in a way that wouldn't be sustainable for my lifestyle, which is why I've chosen to kind of stay at this macro systems level. And so I started pursuing a master's in public health in maternal child health, and started to learn about this beautiful world of doula. And I wasn't, I wasn't a mother at the time. But I've just felt really drawn to supporting women in this critical threshold, this transition in their life, even though I had never experienced it. And, you know, I, I was really drawn towards kind of that holistic support. So one of the things I didn't share was when I initially went through my undergrad, I thought I was gonna go study shamanism in India. And I had signed up to take Hindi and I was on this path to become a healer. And quickly was like, No, that's not what society wants from me, they want me to be like, in international business and doing all these things. So it's interesting how that theme of healer. And just witnessing people's transformation continues to kind of come up in my story. And so this is kind of that, that resurfacing again, as I got exposed, like, Oh, I could do something with my hands like I could be there and support families in this incredible transition. So as I started learning about doula work, and then simultaneously was in the child abuse field, was really seeing the importance of that healthy start into a family that that importance of parents feeling supported, and caring for their children, and maybe creating a new way of caring for their children that they didn't experience in their own childhood. And I think that's critically missing in our society and causes a lot of challenges for parents to feel like real nurture, and prepared to like, raise these little humans. So there is a connection there. And it felt it felt like balancing out what I was seeing, as, you know, kind of like responding to fires and community about things that had already gone awry to starting at the beginning kind of prevention work, in a way, you know, really getting there and supporting these families from the start.
Michael Kithcart:
I just have to say, that is so impressive. And what I also appreciate is that you are doing the work that you thought that you would be doing in undergrad, it's just looking different. Although it'd be super cool if you were a shaman.
Kori Stephens:
(laughing) Right?
Michael Kithcart:
I mean, I'm just gonna say like, that's pretty cool. But the way that you were able to morph what, ultimately you wanted to be doing, to be able to do it as a doula in the service that you're providing and the work that you're doing, how does that then all lead to Resonance Rising?
Kori Stephens:
Yeah. Well, it was a long journey or feels very long. Because within there, I became a mother. And, you know, being pregnant, and also with my doula background, I was like, so excited to experience labor and birth and like, people thought I was crazy. They're like what you want to experience that? And I was doing everything perfect, right? Like I was getting acupuncture, I was going to prenatal yoga, I was doing all of these things, and ended up with an emergency c section. And that was the moment for me where I was like, okay, Kori, you've got to let go of this perfectionism. This like perfect way of being. And becoming a mother is what totally cracked me open to identity evolution to my connection and understanding of spirituality and trying to make meaning of the struggle. And within that experience, is when I really started to explore, like, what is alignment look like, for me, what does it look like for me to be whole, because in so many ways, becoming a mother, I started to feel broken, like I started to feel like I wasn't contributing enough, I couldn't be full time at work and be an amazing mother. And it sent me on this journey of really trying to discover what is wholeness. And those, that personal journey is kind of how I conceptualize leading people from this place of like, overwhelm, and feeling stretched too thin. And yet, they have a spark of like, oh, but I desire more, I desire something different. And so, you know, I thought I had it all figured out with my first kid. And then I had a second. And it taught me a lot, because it was totally different, right. And so I started actually organizing a women's circle for mothers after the birth of my second because I was like, you know, what we need more support in our community, we need to be telling each other the stories that we don't surface with our friends, the number one thing I kept hearing from mothers was that they don't have real relationships with other mothers. And they don't talk about real things. They just talk about these things that their kids are doing are not sleeping through the night, these very surface level conversations. So I started creating these spaces for women to connect and through a business that I called Whole Mama Project. And in doing that work, I learned that I love bringing people together in their transformational journeys. I love creating ceremony and ritual and space for that deeper listening to what people are craving.
Michael Kithcart:
And can I just want to ask because I, I can see what you're saying and what the need is. And I will say I've never birth a child. So I don't know that what's what's surprising to me, because I think of my friends who have kids, and maybe I was friends with them before they had it. But to say that there's a whole collection of women who feel like they don't have real relationships with other mothers. What is that about?
Kori Stephens:
Yeah, I think so many things, I think we're in a very complicated space and understanding what mothering is in society. I think there's a lot of perceptions around like being a stay at home mom or being a working mom. And there's these expectations that we that society has put on, like what we should be doing and how we should be showing up. Like we have to be a great mother, but we should also be taking care of ourselves, you know? And then this huge guilt, like, how do I do both, like I don't really know how to do both. And society actually isn't set up for us to be successful in both. And so we kind of start to put on this facade of either like, I'm an awesome like, Pinterest Mom, I'm doing all these things with my kids. Or I'm the mom who has perfect balance between work and home. And none of these things are real. Like neither one of those experiences I just described are authentic. But yet we want people to perceive that we have it figured out. And so we're afraid to share these stories that don't match up with what we've been told we should be doing.
Michael Kithcart:
That feels very familiar to me to women in the workplace totally. As even, like just the professional line. So what you're saying is that you as a female, you're probably experiencing that as you're growing your career. And then you have you have it all over again, as a mother.
Kori Stephens:
Yep, yep.
Michael Kithcart:
Wow.
Kori Stephens:
Mm-hmm.
Michael Kithcart:
Well, no wonder people need space and, and ritual and and coming together. And through that, then what do you help moms do through the circles?
Kori Stephens:
Yeah, in those experiences, it was really about shifting to this place of witnessing and connecting. And that's what I bring through in Resonance Rising and what I see is like a disconnect in what we're trying to do and changing our communities. Because we're just like telling people what to do, or we're telling them how to fix the problem. but we haven't even stopped to listen and to witness the story and allow them to be fully seen and heard and just that simple shift completely changes this desire for belonging that we're all craving and it helps us actually see how interconnected we are and how we can actually collaborate instead of compete against each other
Michael Kithcart:
Oh my gosh okay because on one level I just want to say to like so often what I hear from people of color is that that when you when is that there's not the time to listen so when you look at like the white supremacy checklist right you know that that what the white supremacy culture then you go through that one of the things is this urgency that is that we don't take the time to listen and to find out what people actually need and so you're speaking directly to that is like because we all have this desire to belong but in order to do that we actually have to listen to one another. And I also feel like that translates to and you said so we are complementing and we are being supportive of one another instead of competing okay well then as women to like and I just have an earlier episode where we talk about why don't women don't support women there's this whole other piece about that not happening too- loaded statement I just gave you, sorry for verbally vomiting.
Kori Stephens:
(laughing) It's all good!
Michael Kithcart:
So tell us Kori how I hear how that may Resonance Rising come about so through your work now what do you help people do?
Kori Stephens:
Yeah, such a great question. So you know one of the things that I experienced so much in my prior work was this you know we're talking about expectations and how we should be showing up as leaders one of the things I saw was people just like raking themselves over the coals and completely throwing their wellbeing out the window in their leadership work and that would show up in these organizations as as literally implementing the systems of oppression we were trying to change the abusive behaviors that we were trying to disrupt inside our organizations so we were actually creating cultures that weren't resilient that weren't honoring this this trauma informed lens in which we're requiring or we're talking about that we're doing this work but are we actually doing this work
Michael Kithcart:
So it's almost like you're repeating the behavior you're trying to fix in the community but you're recreating with inside the culture
Kori Stephens:
Exactly. Yeah yeah and I have found that for so many people it's a combination it's a formula of things right that move us to that and you know I'm guilty of it I was in that system too and part of it is you talked about white supremacy culture part of it is you know that is the culture we live in breed and that is the expectation that we have and so for many of us it's very hard to dismantle that and know where to start right like within white supremacy culture is perfectionism, quantity over quality, power hoarding, right like those are just some of the characteristics and we actually when we are exhausted and when we are not connected to our bodies and what our bodies are telling us in relationship to other people we start to just default into those behaviors because we've been so influenced by role models by school by academia we talked about that that tell us like that's what you should be doing and so my work is to help pull the veil back on that like let's see what are these things that we have held up to be important ways of operating in the world and are they actually working and my answer's no right they're not working so how do we then get a sense of where we need to realign ourselves where do we need to look at our belief systems and create these more expansive agreements that honor that space of truly listening without being what I often call like an ask-hole, like, ask a bunch of questions and then do nothing with it because that's super inauthentic and that's actually causing more harm to community to do that it's fake and
Michael Kithcart:
It creates the illusion that you're actually going to do something about it
Kori Stephens:
Yeah yeah yeah and I started to see you know in my tenure in the child abuse field and kind of in nonprofits in general there was like this The leadership like this, like, say all the right things, but what what is the action? What is the embodiment of what we're saying? And so Resonance Rising, and this whole idea of resonant leadership is like, let's call that into action. Like, let's call that into right relationship, let's understand how we can be resonant because that's how we make a difference. That's how we amplify our message. That's how we connect and change communities, not by these empty statements, these empty commitments.
Michael Kithcart:
And that requires people getting uncomfortable. Totally. And so how do you change the risk of speaking up to actually being about the risk in not doing anything? Which is greater
Kori Stephens:
Yes, I love that. I mean, one of the questions I use a lot when working with teams or working with individuals is like, what is the risk of doing it? And what's the risk of not doing it? You know, it's funny, you bring this up, because we were just talking about this in the resident leader lab about edges. And for a lot of us, this decision point feels like an edge. Right? Like, we know, we kind of know what we should be doing. But we're not really sure what's going to happen if we actually take that step. And that freaks us out a little bit. And so we, we revert back to these really comfortable ways of being these, these ways that we know are tried and true. And I'm putting that in quotes. I know you can't see me. But these tried and true ways of being are leading. But they're not working, which is why we got to the edge in the first place, which is why we got to this decision point of like, I need to do something different. And so the process is really identifying what's uncomfortable about being in that space? And what stories have I built around? what's on the other side of this edge? What's for me back in my comfort zone? And then what does it look like to take action? Because I think what I see a lot of is leaders feeling stuck. And I think with the civil unrest that we experienced last year, and we continue to experience I mean that that's been around forever. But we're finally there's like a reckoning to it, is that there's a lot of leaders, specifically white leaders in the nonprofit space, who feel immobilized. Like, they don't know, what is the right next step. And they're operating from this binary decision, like a good or a bad. But if we just sit and we stagnate, then we're going to be more uncomfortable. And then we're going to like, not move, and we're going to be stagnant, and we're going to be uncomfortable, and it's a vicious cycle. But what we need to do is we need to act, we need to take a little step forward and create new beliefs that are supportive to why it's important for us to move in that direction. How is that connected to our value? And what we want to see to be different?
Michael Kithcart:
Yeah, yeah, that there's so much in that. And I mean, there's lots that you've said that I have to own, I've been out, I'm a white female, I've been in an executive role in nonprofit. When I look at the white supremacy culture, it speaks so much to the corporate environments that I've been in. And I've been in leadership roles. And so I have to examine, like, what's my contribution to this? And it's, it is deep, and it's what we have to have a willingness to do that. One of the best. And I don't know, I wouldn't call it advice. But just something that has helped free me up is like, we're all going to make mistakes around race, everybody, regardless of our backgrounds, our race or genders, anything but- the danger is therefore then not talking about it, period, not taking any action, even if that step is wrong, right. Yeah. Like then we can adapt, we can pivot to the left or right and keep going. Yep. So what are some of the ways that you help leaders actually take action?
Kori Stephens:
Yeah, and it's interesting what you just shared, right? There is like perfectionism at its finest, right? Like, we're not going to take action unless it's perfect, because we're terrified of failing,
Michael Kithcart:
Or making the wrong move or saying the wrong thing. And it's like, we say the wrong things all the time. Like, if you really thought about it, if you're ever expressing your viewpoint, if Yeah, you know, so we so what, but there's certain circumstances that paralyze people and prevent us from doing anything so you help on paralyzed?
Kori Stephens:
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, and it's interesting. So I was just in a workshop with an amazing conversation around holding safe space and one of the women of color in that group said, We don't need allies, we need solidarity, we need you to be solid. And so for me solid is it starts within, like, we shouldn't be talking about what needs to change. I mean, we can, but I think we need to really hold up the mirror like that's the first part. And I just want to say, you know, like most, not all of my work is focused on dismantling white supremacy. But that knowing that that's the lens that usually influences how we get how we make sense of our worth, how we make sense of our place in the world. So I really think like how I help people move through that is to get a sense of who they are, and figuring out that alignment. Because if we're not solid, and who we are, what we believe in what we value, we have a really hard time navigating uncertainty. We like don't have a compass to figure out that we'll be okay. If we move through that discomfort. We don't have that sense of safety if we don't know who we are. And then understanding Okay, now I know who we are, who I am. So now how am I in relationship with other people? And that comes back to kind of what we talked about earlier of being more of a witness than advising, like how do we actually create these real deep, authentic relationships? Not this empty conversation, that doesn't feel real. And then, you know, from there, helping them create the spaces, the cultures, the environments that allow everyone to really kind of step into that. So first, it's holding up that mirror. And then seeing Okay, how does that then play out in these other spaces?
Michael Kithcart:
Yeah. How does that tie in? Because I really do love the title that you use of wholeness, revolutionary. And as I am getting to know you more and more, it just seems so fitting. So just share with us what that that represents for you.
Kori Stephens:
Yeah, yeah. So that's so rooted in my own personal experience. So I mentioned when I became a mother, it's kind of when things cracked open for me. And I actually started working with a coach to identify my values. And one of the values I identified was wholeness. But I was operating at a complete deficit of wholeness, like I couldn't even define like, what would wholeness look like for me? And was I actually doing things daily that contributed to my sense of wholeness. And so, as I dug into that, and explored and like, started to figure out what wholeness meant, for me, that's what helped me move into that title of wholeness revolutionary, because I am so passionate about people finding what wholeness is, for them, it's different for every single one of us. And also, no one is broken. Like, I think there's a lot of messages out there that say, like, you need my help, because this is wrong about you, or you need my help, because this is not working for you. And I really want people to lean into the fact that we are all whole, we are all whole being. And we deserve to have our whole expression in the world. And so wholeness revolutionary both applies to helping people step into that full expression, that whole of who they are, but also helping organizations create cultures that make it safe to do that. Because I've been in a lot of places where people are like, yeah, bring your whole self to work, you know, bring all the things. And then you do and they're like, Oh, no, no, no, not that part. This, maybe not that part that makes me uncomfortable. I don't really want that full part in my workplace in this team. Which is such a detriment, right? to how we can relate and build and transform together. So that's, that's where that comes from, and why I'm so passionate about it.
Michael Kithcart:
Yes, well, you and you can hear it, you can hear it in your voice, Kori and that wholeness piece is really interesting, because it also feels like it goes along with psychological safety in a in a cultural environment, right is so totally, you say we- Come, be yourself have all- be all these things. But then leadership chips away at that and creates willing- knowingly or unknowingly, right? chips it away to the point where it erodes trust, and people don't feel safe being themselves in those types of environments. So, you know, you say that leaders need to be committed to personal development and an evolution. Kind of like what's your take on how you help them do that and how they can create those environments. those cultures, they can create cultures that really are what they say they should be, but don't necessarily create. Does that make sense?
Kori Stephens:
Yeah, absolutely. Um, yeah, I don't think you can be a good leader today without spending a significant amount of time I continuing to develop yourself, you know, like, it's not a destination, we don't get to a point where we're like, I know everything about myself, I'm good. You know, it's a, it's a process, it's cyclical, we step forward, we move backwards. And the way that wholeness ties into that, for me is honoring both the light in the dark, right, the good, and the very challenging kind of baggage pieces that we bring with us, that influence how we connect with people and, and how we ultimately, you know, operationalize our mission in the world. And so, personal development looks different for every person. I think what I like to do is to help people really reconnect with their own innate wisdom, that intuition, and there's a lot of ways that we talk about that it's, you know, it's actually being in our bodies. I think this is a piece that is missed from a lot of professional development, where we're really heady, like, we think a lot about what we should be doing differently. We think, you know, like all the Strengths Finders and Myers Briggs, like, it's very academic, it's very theoretical. But we don't spend a lot of time like getting in to our body and allowing that to help us navigate. And I think we've probably all you've probably had this experience, Michael, where you've stepped into a room and you just, you immediately get a sense of the vibe, you get a sense of the energy of whether or not like, Oh, this is how I can show up here. Or, oh, I'm just gonna, I'm just gonna hide a little bit in this space, because this doesn't feel like a match. And that's kind of where Resonance comes in. For me, because Resonance is, it's a vibration. It's an attunement, it's a it's like a wave. And we can't create that if we're not in our bodies. And the name actually comes from I was in a coaching class. And at the end of this class, we had to say one word that identified every person that we just spent, like the last three days with, and one of the ladies who's in the class of me, the word she gave me was resonant. And I was like, Oh, my God, that's exactly what I'm going for, like, I'm so glad that that came out. Because resonant to me is like being able to hold that container, being able to be fully present in our bodies, to understand and to allow that trust in our bodies to navigate the challenging experiences. So personal development, to me is both the heavy stuff, but also like, get into our bodies. Let's ground, let's be mindful. And what does that teach us? How does that lead us? In our next step? Yes.
Michael Kithcart:
Absolute alignment with you on that it looks different, right for each person's practice. What I'm curious about on that, as you've noticed, with COVID, because now we're, you know, a year into this, that there's been more of a detachment of the head and body, there's been, you know, numbing as a coping mechanism, you know, choose your, your choice. And what are the benefits? If you know, somebody is feeling like out? Definitely not, not in tune with body? What are some of the benefits that we receive by actually coming back into it and paying attention to what our body's telling us?
Kori Stephens:
Yeah. Well, I think so many things. The first thing that I usually witness in people when they get back into their bodies is they start to become aware of how unsustainable their paces because when we're in our head, it's in time is, I have a belief that time was like, not real. It's like time is just kind of amorphous. It's just the way that we like create units and containers in which we do things.
Michael Kithcart:
Yes, but it let we let it control us.
Kori Stephens:
Yeah, yeah, we totally do. Yes, yeah. So I find that when people are in their minds, there's a totally different perception of time, or this belief that like, of course, I can get all those things done in my to do list because I put them on this sheet of paper. Well, at the same time, your body is like exhausted or maybe you're getting sick, or maybe you're overeating or like all the things you talked about with numbing out and you're never feeling restored. You're not getting good sleep, right. And I've seen some Many people finally decide like, Okay, I need to listen to my body when they get sick. But what I want to teach is like, you don't actually have to get sick. So listen to your body. And when we get into it, it allows us to, like, it helps us set the pace. For our day, when we're really attuned to what our body needs throughout the day, or just kind of cyclically throughout the year. Like we're just coming out of winter, right? Our body in winter is signifying rest, step into the void. It's okay to like, want to be cozy and comfy and sit by a fire and read stories like allow yourself to do that. And then in spring, we start to feel this, like, our body starts to open, you know, our body starts to be like, Okay, I'm ready. I'm ready for new things. So I think that's the first thing is pace. And then I also think the second benefit of being in our body is it actually helps us remember moments more clearly. And I often work with people to be really connected to their senses. And when we're connected to our senses, like when we're actually listening with our ears, right? When we're actually seeing like the expansiveness of beauty, when we're actually tasting our food, when we're actually feeling that embrace for the people we can be with. Those moments are so much more powerful, because we're mono tasking. And there's a lot of like biochemistry behind this too, right? Like, if we're multitasking, and we're trying to do 1000 things at once, we're actually depleting chemicals in our brain. And no wonder we feel tired, because literally, I think most of us multitask all day long, right? Like, we listen to a podcast and we go for a walk in the woods, or we're watching a webinar, and we're answering emails, and then we get to like six or seven o'clock at night, and we just crash. Because we weren't in our body, we were allowing our mind to be in 1000 different places.
Michael Kithcart:
Yes, though, the two benefits that you just described, you know, pacing, and also being able to remember things more vividly is those are good motivators. Right? Like, they can really be attributed, I think, to a lot of the challenges or struggles that people are going through right now. So to be able to bring them to a specific place that they can, like, here, here's the benefit of actually stopping down. I think it's something that people can hear and then would actually be motivated to take action on. So I'm applauding you Yay. I want to just also touch base on Womxn Rising, which is that I love it. It's a safe space for women to embrace radical and unapologetic accountability in their work and relationships. share some of the work that you're doing behind this mission, because it's powerful.
Kori Stephens:
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, this is this is one of those spaces where you teach what you have to learn, right. And having been in the nonprofit field for 11, 11-12 years, it's primarily women dominated most of the leaders of nonprofits are women. Most of the senior strategy, kind of senior program, people in the nonprofit field are women. And as I was, you know, shared earlier about kind of the the perpetuation of some of these systems of oppression within our organizations. This is so true in female run nonprofits, or at least in my experience, where there is this horizontal hostility, or relational aggression, right, that upholds white supremacy, it upholds, you know, ways of being in the world that have women continuing to question their value and their worth. And we do it to each other. And that is toxic, and it is harmful. And it is getting in the way of us actually making a difference because we're spending so much time tearing other people down, not allowing them to have access to power, you know, spreading rumors, some of those things. And I have contributed to that. I've been on the receiving end of that. And it neither place on contributing or receiving feels good. Right? Right. That doesn't ever feel good.
Michael Kithcart:
I'm there with you. I yeah, I experienced the same thing. I have been a leader and nonprofit I have contributed to it and I have experienced it. And I experienced it to a degree where I would say that's the moment in life that it broke me. And it's a hard thing to recover from.
Kori Stephens:
It is hard. And you know, I think the the story that I often think of when this was a pretty big awakening for me was, when I had my second son, I decided I would take a year off to travel because my job was super heavy and travel, I was traveling three to four times a month. And after my first son, I just went straight back to it, and it literally killed me, you know, trying to like pump in airport restrooms, and all that stuff is terrible. So with my second, I was like, Okay, I'm going to take a year off of travel. And I wasn't sure if I could ask for that. Because no one had asked for that before. And it was like part of my job to travel. And what was surprising to me was that the the men in my movement, were totally supportive of that I didn't receive any negative feedback from them about asking for that. It was the women that surprised me, it was the women who were like, Oh, I guess I'll just see you in a year, then, you know, this kind of passive aggressive way of saying, I didn't get that. So you don't deserve that. And that's when it really hit me of like, okay, that, that we need to fix that, we need to fix that in our movement, or conferences that we go to that are primarily women who are attending these conferences, and we don't have nursing rooms set up, or we haven't considered, you know, all the different ways to support each other in this work. So Womxn Rising is meant to highlight that in a very inclusive space, because the other important thing for me is intersectionality. In this my experiences primarily as a white woman, which is totally different from a woman of color, or a person of color who identifies as a female. And we need to be able to be in those spaces together, kind of back to what you're talking about with solidarity, how do we actually stand solid for each other in our intersectionality as women? And so in this, really wanting to explore radical accountability to ourselves, understanding how relational aggression shows up in our spaces through gossip, and rumors, and all of those things? And how do we benefit from that? Which is like, that hurts to identify how we benefit from that, but we do sometimes. And then what is the detriment of that which is much greater than how we benefit from it. But then really moving us into this, like, what do we do about it? How do we call in what we're talking about as revolutionary love as a different way to be with women in these kind of change agent roles in these community organizing roles? I'm really excited about it. It's it's, I'm partnering with an amazing woman, Shaundelle Darris, who runs Resiliency, an amazing organization, you should totally check it out. And we're just really excited about what we're creating and the potential of what could come from that space.
Michael Kithcart:
That's great. And Can people sign up for Womxn Rising?
Kori Stephens:
Yeah, the applications are open. And we're going to be starting, we're going to have to adjust the timeline, we actually received a grant to support BIPOC community leaders in their participation. So that's really exciting. So we're probably going to push back till mid May. But applications are open on my website, if that's something you're interested in, or it speaks to you.
Michael Kithcart:
Yes, that's great. And we'll be sure to put that link in the show notes. Kori, how else can people follow you and find out more about the work that you're doing?
Kori Stephens:
Ah, yeah, I think the best place is to sign up for the newsletter on my website. I'm in the process of completely revamping that, in honor of not being an ask-hole. I just asked the people who followed me what they actually want, what do they want to hear from me? How can I actually support them and so I'm completely changing what I'm including in my newsletter, to include things like free meditations and free resources and affirmations and some of those things that people are really craving. So I'd say that's like the best place to get the juiciest information. And then, from there, Instagram, I'm on Instagram @Korimusing. And then on LinkedIn, you can find me at Kori Stephens.
Michael Kithcart:
Okay. That's great. Kori, thank you so much for sharing so much wisdom. I mean, really a lot of thought provoking statements that you've made. today. I can't wait to go back and listen to this. Thank you for taking the time.
Kori Stephens:
Thank you, Michael.
Michael Kithcart:
And hey, thank all of you for listening to this podcast. If you've been getting a lot of value from these episodes, would you please be sure to subscribe and rate the podcast on iTunes. I'd also be very greatful if you'd leave a review. And please share this podcast with your friends and network on social. That way I can help more people and amplify the voices of the great guests that come on to the podcast just like Kori. Thanks for listening and I'll catch you on the next episode.
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